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3.01.2008

Further Discussion

I recently decided to research a particular issues based on some assumptions made by a family member, which turned out to be misplaced. It all revolves around an idea which is part of an ongoing conversation in the emerging church, but which has (sadly) been misinterpreted and scandalized by those who don't understand the meaning behind the discussion.

That idea is about how people, both inside and outside the church, view the crucifixion and it's purpose. This is an issue with which I have been wrestling for quite a while, and I will attempt here to explain how and why. . .

When I reached my mid 20's, I started seeing the church in a whole new way, and I didn't like what I saw. There seemed to be a lot of ideas and actions, which just didn't fit with the God I believed in or with what the Bible seemed to teach. This led me on a long journey of searching and re-thinking, basically trying to find the truth. During this time, I continued my relationship with God, but stopped going to church because I felt this was where my confusion had begun. I did, however, start looking for a group of people who had questions similar to my own. Much to my surprise, there were groups all over the internet searching for answers and having discussions about the very issues which were on my heart. It was pretty amazing, and my relationship with God grew as a result of taking part in these conversations.

At the beginning of this journey, however, there was one, monumental stone in my path to growth and discovery. And that was the violence of the crucifixion. This was around the time that the movie, "Passion of the Christ" came out, and I reluctantly went to see it. I knew it would not be pleasant, but what I did not know, was that it would cause me to question God. I was completely mortified and horrified by the violence that was, as I had understood it, part of God's requirements of his son. I was confused and angry, because, up until this point in my journey, I had come to experience God as loving and caring. It felt like I had been tricked, and that God was completely different than how I had personally come to know him to be. So, not knowing exactly what to do with these feelings, I stopped all communications. . .stopped seeking, stopped praying. This went on for several months until finally I felt like I could face my questions and doubts. The first thing I did, was to talk to God about these things, and surprisingly, I discovered that he was still loving and caring. . .not violent at all.

So, now we come to the idea that has caused so much controversy. It can be summed up in the following quote, which hopefully now, after reading my story, will be easier to understand:

“How then have we come to believe that at the cross this God of love suddenly decides to vent his anger and wrath on his own son? The fact is that the cross ISN'T a form of cosmic child abuse — a vengeful father punishing his son for an offense he has not even committed. Understandably, both people inside and outside of the church have found this twisted version of events morally dubious and a huge barrier to faith."
Apologetics Index

From my own personal experience, and from the similar stories of others, the fact of the matter is this. Many people cannot reconcile the violence of the crucifixion to a God who is supposed to be loving and caring, and just because you disagree with their doubts or dismiss them as sacrilegious doesn't make the issue disappear. Especially when you have so many people out there (like myself) who are no longer able to accept the messages taught in churches and professed by other Christians at face value due to the incongruencies therein.

Fortunately, since the experience I related above, I have continued searching for an answer to who God truly is. I have found a lot of answers and have received a lot of confirmation in my search. . .but until recently, I had sort-of tabled searching further into the whole crucifixion and violence issue. I hadn't really encountered any suitable explanations or new interpretations that were different enough from what I grew up with and no longer deemed thorough enough to satisfy my questions, so I just waited and did a lot of reading and thinking. However, this recent discussion has really helped me organize my thoughts and has caused me to search a little deeper.

Let me begin the explanation of what I have recently discovered with another quote, which I found particularly helpful:

"I think the gospel is a many faceted diamond, and atonement is only one facet...Atonement-centered understandings of the gospel (can) create vampire
Christians who want Jesus for his blood and little else. He calls us to move beyond a gospel of sin management’ to the gospel of the kingdom of God. So, rather than focusing on an alternative theory of atonement, I’d suggest we ponder the meaning and
mission of the kingdom of God.”
Apologetics Index

This statement leads me back to my original post which started this whole discussion. ALL aspects of Jesus' time on earth are tied together and vital to promoting God's Kingdom. Well, for me, it was obvious how his message to live lives of peace, love and justice could promote God's Kingdom, but I was still a little cloudy on how his crucifixion fit into the picture. Anyway, I finally came across some explanations of atonement that really helped put everything together for me. Here they are:

Six Theories about Atonement (greatly condensed):
Ransom Theory - Through our sin, we placed ourselves under the authority of Satan. Jesus comes and offers himself as ransom for us. . .and we're set free to live for and with God again.

Substitutionary Theory - God's merciful act of absolute goodness and selflessness in giving himself through Jesus on the cross satisfies or cancels out or absorbs God's anger about our human evil.

Christus Victor Theory - Our enemy is death. By entering into and overcoming death, Jesus opens the door for us to enter eternal life.

Perfect Penitent Theory - Jesus' acceptance of death on behalf of the whole human race, is seen as perfect repentance for us (or, on our behalf).

Moral Influence Theory - The cross demonstrates Jesus' self-giving, his complete abandonment to God's will, for the sake of the world. When that sacrificial love touches us, we are changed internally so we want to stop being selfish.

Power Weakness Theory - By becoming vulnerable on the cross and accepting suffering from everyone, rather than visiting suffering on everyone, Jesus is showing God's loving heart. The cross calls us to welcome God's kingdom through self-sacrifice.


These may be familiar to some of you, but I was surprised that there were so many different theories. What struck me more, however, was that I couldn't agree entirely with every one of these, but I couldn't disagree entirely either. Strangely enough, I found this to be immensely helpful. It made me see that I don't necessarily have to adopt one of these theories as my own, but as a whole, they give me a clearer view. . .maybe not the whole sky, but at least a nice big window. And for me, that was all I needed.

I know, for some of you, that might be a little too inconclusive, but I would rather leave you to draw your own conclusions.

posted by Danielle | 2:03 PM

7 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

Danielle, as your mother I am very proud of you for seeking and searching and finding the answers to such deep and important questions of faith. I also admire your transparency in sharing so openly what has transpired.

Since you live here at the time, I knew "something" had happened, but there was so much going on about that time, including my cancer, that I could not put my finger on what it was. All I could do was pray that God would draw you to Himself!

The cross is the greatest proof that God IS a loving God. Jesus said, "My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you. Greater love has no man than this, that he lay down his life for his friends." (John 15:12,13)

I'm very proud of all of you girls and am so pleased to see you sharing with each other in such important and meaningful discusssions. You ALL are beautiful and intelligent, and I am very unbiased, of course!!

Love, Momma

8:47 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

What a wonderful telling of your journey of faith! Like you, I feel that all those theories listed at the end of your post, all put together make up the entire picture of why Jesus had to suffer violence on our behalf (at least, that is what I understood you to be saying, correct me if I'm wrong.) You cannot single out just one theory, or it leaves out the entire big picture. Like you said, as a whole they do indeed give us a clearer view. It does make a nice big window into the beauty of what Christ has done for us and makes available to us as members of His kingdom.

Thank you for sharing your personal story. I think similar things are happening to many in your generation as they grapple with what they see in the scriptures, as compared to what they heard or experienced or understood from growing up in church. I don't think anybody on the family site needs to "worry" about you. :)

Sometimes I think it's harder to sort through theology when you grow up in the church, as compared to having no church background at all. You have to sort out what was true that you were taught, and what was false, and then you have to fix your thinking about the false and the true. If you came from no church background, you aren't sorting through ecclesiastical thought that you assumed was correct, when it may not have been.

Thanks again for taking the time to put your personal experience into writing for us.

Melinda

1:12 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Thanks for sharing. Whenever I think of you, I think of you in this moment. You were maybe 2-3 (could have the age wrong) and I had put on my favorite album of that time - the music from "Somewhere in Time" starring Christopher Reeves (before he even thought of being superman). Mom and Dad weren't home at the time so, even though it was classical and they probably wouldn't have minded, I had the music playing so loud that the notes vibrated through your bones. It was beautiful, haunting music filled with hope, love and promise. You were in your bedroom playing with your toys and when I walked in to see how you were doing, the music's haunting and emotional notes had touched you so much you had tears streaming down your face. You had this look of love and emotion in your little
eyes. Emotions far too mature for your age. I felt I
got a glimpse of who you would grow to become. A
compassionate, empathetic, sincere, genuine and
wonderful woman. I wisked you up in my arms and we danced and hugged until the song was over. I love that memory/picture of you and that moment (even more so than the cookie baking memories). You probably don't even remember but everytime I am with you or think of you I remember it. Guess what, you became that woman ... keep growing and becoming.

xo
Melo

5:51 PM  
Blogger Danielle said...

I do remember! I even remember what the music sounded like. To this day, music touches my heart in that way.

I recently came across an author who could express so well how I feel when it comes to the depth of emotion and feeling found in music. Her name is Anne Lamott. Here are a few of my favorite quotes of hers. . .

"How come you can hear a chord, and then another chord, and then your heart breaks open?"

"The singing enveloped me. It was furry and resonant, coming from everyone's heart. There was no sense of performance or judgment, only that the music was breath and food. . .Somehow the singing wore down all the boundaries and distinctions that kept me so isolated."

Thank you for reminding me of this wonderful memory, Mel!

Love you!
Dani

5:52 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This is what I missed by already being married and gone by the time Danielle was born. :( All my memories of her as a child are wrapped up in her interactions with my own kids. I think we have just started to get to know each other as sisters and it is a wonderful thing!

Melinda

7:38 PM  
Blogger Danielle said...

It has been good to get to know you better too, Melinda! All of my memories are of you as a wife and mother, which really made you seem like more of an aunt or something. I was happy to see that we have some similarities, and can listen to eachother's thoughts and ideas.

Regarding your first comment under this post. Yes, that is what I'm saying. All of those theories have important pieces to them, that, if left out, would leave the picture less clear. Of the theories I listed, I do have my favorites, but they wouldn't mean as much, and I also wouldn't be able to relate to other people as well, if I ignored my least favorites.

Also. Melo, the name of that song that made me cry was Rhapsody on a Theme of Paganini. I looked it up online, and then downloaded the whole soundtrack to our computer. :)

And, Mom. Thank you for your supportive words. It was good to hear from you, and also to get to visit on the phone last night.

8:56 PM  
Blogger Jackie said...

Danielle, I have tears in my eyes as I read through these comments from all of you, my precious family. I am so touched by the love I sense in each comment! I am so happy to call you three girls my precious nieces and to call your momma my sweet sister!

Danielle, back to your post, I cannot tell you how happy I am that you have so VERY diligently sought for truth. When I saw from your postings that you were so very honestly seeking for truth about God, I felt so thankful, for I knew you would find truth. That is because I very much believe the promise of Jesus that when you ask (as you said you did) you will receive, when you seek you will find, and when you knock the door will be opened. Danielle, I am so glad you have been seeking for what you could believe instead of just accepting someone else's creed. This way, your belief system is truly yours! It's not just what you borrowed from someone else.

Danielle, like you, I think there is something in each one of those definitions that gives us another aspect of why Jesus gave His life for us. Just the very fact that it works that way is a reminder of how God has created us each one as a unique person and given us each a different piece to add to the puzzle. It's another reason why we need to listen to one another, I believe.

So, in summation, Danielle, I thank you for just being you and being so transparent in your sharing! We can and will all benefit from that! I also want to thank you all as Danielle's family for the love I see that you each have in your hearts. I really thank God for the very beautiful work I am seeing Him do in each one of you, as you each are His unique creation, being yourselves and doing it very well! I just love you all!

I will add this to those of you who are not related to Danielle: I apologize for the "family love" talk. Thanks for understanding!

Love,
Aunt Jackie

9:51 PM  

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